The year is 2004. Your wife just gave birth to a baby girl. You couldn't be any happier. 2007 comes, you're teaching her to ride a bike, at this point it really hit you, you created offspring. It is literally a product of yourself. Fast forward to 2017, shes entering highschool. You are having a difficult time coming to terms with this yet you are proud. It's a little while into 2018 and you finally gain the courage to check her phone, you trust her and you know won't see anything fishy afterall you dedicated your best years to raising her. You open her texts and what do you see? https://postimg.org/image/6dyn0diof/
https://twitter.com/BostonUprising/status/983109753059663872
Remember when Kazper vs Kephrii used to be about widow...
Loco [#10]just Life ban him and let the police deal with it from there, this is beyond OWL drama
on a slightly less serious note, LiNkzr is his Girlfriend? :P
People have really lame twitter handles.
https://twitter.com/overwatchleague/status/983111158260424704?s=21
From T3 Jail to OWL to Actual Jail soon
nanimal [#16]Kazper, there are some headshots you shouldn't take...
i don't know if this is funny given the context my guy
Wth... When are we goin to find the cocaine dealer?
No really what the f is wrong with these guys?
Maybe I'm too old to understand, is it just being born in the twitter/reddit/whatevercrap generation?
EDIT: He's an idiot, and deserves everything that's gonna come his way, I truly believe this, she isn't better thou, going public with this (that was mutual) right after Boston defeated Huston (her fav team)?
https://imgur.com/a/eUMVB
wentaway [#22]Wth... When are we goin to find the cocaine dealer?
No really what the f is wrong with these guys?
Maybe I'm too old to understand, is it just being born in the twitter/reddit/whatevercrap generation?
EDIT: He's an idiot, and deserves everything that's gonna come his way, I truly believe this, she isn't better thou, going public with this (that was mutual) right after Boston defeated Huston (her fav team)?
https://imgur.com/a/eUMVB
wentaway [#22]Wth... When are we goin to find the cocaine dealer?
No really what the f is wrong with these guys?
Maybe I'm too old to understand, is it just being born in the twitter/reddit/whatevercrap generation?
EDIT: He's an idiot, and deserves everything that's gonna come his way, I truly believe this, she isn't better thou, going public with this (that was mutual) right after Boston defeated Huston (her fav team)?
https://imgur.com/a/eUMVB
Yeah be careful though, I mentioned how she isn't 100% innocent on Twitter and got blocked by Richard Lewis and bombarded by people trying to get a like from him. It is fact that it was two idiots not one, that doesnt mean that one ISN'T more responsible than the other (dreamkazper) but it is still her fault as well. Everyone wants to seem like a good person so they need to protect the "raped" little girl who definitely had no idea what she was doing.
twerp [#5]DansGame
now here's something actually worthy of a punishment by blizzard
Is not even Blizzard that should punish him, Blizard is a private company, is not their business punishing law infringements, it's the actual law that should take care of it.
Guinea [#24]Yeah be careful though, I mentioned how she isn't 100% innocent on Twitter and got blocked by Richard Lewis and bombarded by people trying to get a like from him. It is fact that it was two idiots not one, that doesnt mean that one ISN'T more responsible than the other (dreamkazper) but it is still her fault as well. Everyone wants to seem like a good person so they need to protect the "raped" little girl who definitely had no idea what she was doing.
Yep exactely, I know everyone reacts differently, but they way she's posting and portraying everything just seems... wrong?
I mean if she really was "abused" I really feel sorry for her, a very good friend of mine was sexually harrassed by his father's best friend when she was 16, she only managed to open up more than 20 years later (after the death of her father), and I realized that good part of the woman I loved (as a friend) was due to that shit that happened to her so many years ago.
This is some serious shit. :(
wentaway [#26]Yep exactely, I know everyone reacts differently, but they way she's posting and portraying everything just seems... wrong?
I mean if she really was "abused" I really feel sorry for her, a very good friend of mine was sexually harrassed by his father's best friend when she was 16, she only managed to open up more than 20 years later (after the death of her father), and I realized that good part of the woman I loved (as a friend) was due to that shit that happened to her so many years ago.
This is some serious shit. :(
Exactly. What you described with your friend is abuse, but actively responding and engaging with someone older out of your own volition is literally just being dumb. Acting like she didn't know what she was doing is pretty much indirectly calling her dumb. It doesn't matter if she was flattered or admired him, the fact that she mentioned his age to him and continued when he was fine with it is enough to show that she was responsible as well.
twerp [#5]DansGame
now here's something actually worthy of a punishment by blizzard
Imagine if he was on fusion...
Guinea [#27]Exactly. What you described with your friend is abuse, but actively responding and engaging with someone older out of your own volition is literally just being dumb. Acting like she didn't know what she was doing is pretty much indirectly calling her dumb. It doesn't matter if she was flattered or admired him, the fact that she mentioned his age to him and continued when he was fine with it is enough to show that she was responsible as well.
i think you're missing the concept as to why 18 is the age of consent in US. any younger you're expected to be dumb and not competent enough to make that decision yourself. so you're depending on anyone 18+ to be responsible enough to not interact with anyone younger in that manner under any circumstances.
she's 14 and he did interact with her in that way. yeah maybe she had ill intentions going into it or it developed into ill intentions (after seeing the "get what he deserves hehe " tweet), but that doesn't matter at all. it all falls onto his shoulders. he's an adult and she's a kid being a kid
twerp [#29]i think you're missing the concept as to why 18 is the age of consent in US. any younger you're expected to be dumb and not competent enough to make that decision yourself. so you're depending on anyone 18+ to be responsible enough to not interact with anyone younger in that manner under any circumstances.
she's 14 and he did interact with her in that way. yeah maybe she had ill intentions going into it or it developed into ill intentions (after seeing the "get what he deserves hehe " tweet), but that doesn't matter at all. it all falls onto his shoulders. he's an adult and she's a kid being a kid
Yeah someone mentioned the legal part of it to me on Twitter and I admitted that I overlooked that, but at the same time regardless of whether its a sexual situation or not any 14 year old should know right from wrong, and based on everything else shes been saying it's pretty obvious she knows right from wrong. She even continued talking to him after they both said it was weird meaning Boy is actively participating in something they know is wrong and Girl is actively participating in something wrong. I personally think the particular situation should be looked at deeper than "Well shes a minor he's not, poor her" And like i said before, he is clearly MORE responsible but people are acting as if she was forced into something.
twerp [#29]i think you're missing the concept as to why 18 is the age of consent in US. any younger you're expected to be dumb and not competent enough to make that decision yourself. so you're depending on anyone 18+ to be responsible enough to not interact with anyone younger in that manner under any circumstances.
she's 14 and he did interact with her in that way. yeah maybe she had ill intentions going into it or it developed into ill intentions (after seeing the "get what he deserves hehe " tweet), but that doesn't matter at all. it all falls onto his shoulders. he's an adult and she's a kid being a kid
Nobody (at least here, for sure not me) is denying that twerp, this opens up a different argument thou, one that will expose me for the old geezer I am, why should a 14 year old girl/guy have free unmonitored access to internet and a cellphone?
Yes you can get in a lot of trouble even without those tools, it just requires dedication, while like this all it takes is the time to type a sentence.
The fact she was still actively posting on Twitter is wrong as well, luckily she (or someone else) made the account private.
Guinea [#24]Yeah be careful though, I mentioned how she isn't 100% innocent on Twitter and got blocked by Richard Lewis and bombarded by people trying to get a like from him. It is fact that it was two idiots not one, that doesnt mean that one ISN'T more responsible than the other (dreamkazper) but it is still her fault as well. Everyone wants to seem like a good person so they need to protect the "raped" little girl who definitely had no idea what she was doing.
Her innocence or fault is irrelevant. DreamKazper had full control of his actions and could have, on his own, stopped this from occurring. Even if you don't like the way she acted, nothing she did lessens how bad of a person Dream is.
That being said, do you remember being 14? I was an idiot at 14, my friends were idiots at 14, I'm not particularly concerned about how this girl acts at 14.
Raisin [#32]Her innocence or fault is irrelevant. DreamKazper had full control of his actions and could have, on his own, stopped this from occurring. Even if you don't like the way she acted, nothing she did lessens how bad of a person Dream is.
That being said, do you remember being 14? I was an idiot at 14, my friends were idiots at 14, I'm not particularly concerned about how this girl acts at 14.
I was marginally smarter as a 21 year old male. DK screwed up big time, and he'll have to face the punishment that comes with it. But none of these kids are prepared for how life changing this experience has been for them, and it seems to me that the OWL is doing a poor job of helping them through real-life. Most sport stars were pseudo celebs their whole lives, and figured out how to manage the expectations and popularity since they were young teens. Most of these kids in OWL are just figuring this out for the first time in their lives right now.
Just as i start to be inspired by dreamkazper's performance... this happens... terrible situation and i feel sorry that girl had to go through that even if she isn't completely innocent... The family atmosphere of boston is what i loved most about the team and the fact that they were family with kazper... i can imagine the pain they must feel knowing their former friend did something like this... I especially feel bad for striker man... i feel like striker really looked up to him...
Jobon [#34]I was marginally smarter as a 21 year old male. DK screwed up big time, and he'll have to face the punishment that comes with it. But none of these kids are prepared for how life changing this experience has been for them, and it seems to me that the OWL is doing a poor job of helping them through real-life. Most sport stars were pseudo celebs their whole lives, and figured out how to manage the expectations and popularity since they were young teens. Most of these kids in OWL are just figuring this out for the first time in their lives right now.
What is the OWL supposed to do about players engaging in sexual misconduct with 14 year olds................. ??? Becoming a celebrity and pedophilia are two different realms
Raisin [#32]Her innocence or fault is irrelevant. DreamKazper had full control of his actions and could have, on his own, stopped this from occurring. Even if you don't like the way she acted, nothing she did lessens how bad of a person Dream is.
That being said, do you remember being 14? I was an idiot at 14, my friends were idiots at 14, I'm not particularly concerned about how this girl acts at 14.
Her parents should thou, and generally speaking all parents should pay attention to their kids, even if "just" to avoid them ending up in situations like this.
I remember starting smoking when I was 14, and that older friend of mine who made me try, I know this is a whole different magnitude of a situation, but I don't blame him for making me start smoking, my parents did blame him, I stil don't now, almost 30 years later and still a smoker, it was on me I was already old enough to understand I was doing something wrong and why?
Well the answer is simple, my parents.
KoleeKo [#36]What is the OWL supposed to do about players engaging in sexual misconduct with 14 year olds................. ??? Becoming a celebrity and pedophilia are two different realms
We'll see how the investigation goes. For now, I am giving him the benefit of the doubt with the facts that we have. Everything else is just her word against his. She never told him how old she was. And she seems pretty pushy in those text messages in getting him to incriminate himself, by assuming he did know. There is also no proof that he knew she was 14. There is 1 message saying he knew she was in high school, and for all we know, that may have been the first time he realized she was 15 at the time.
Jobon [#38]We'll see how the investigation goes. For now, I am giving him the benefit of the doubt with the facts that we have. Everything else is just her word against his. She never told him how old she was. And she seems pretty pushy in those text messages in getting him to incriminate himself, by assuming he did know. There is also no proof that he knew she was 14. There is 1 message saying he knew she was in high school, and for all we know, that may have been the first time he realized she was 15 at the time.
Just because you don't know the age of someone online does not mean you get to assume they are over 18. Regardless of whether or not he knew her age, it's still a crime.
Raisin [#39]Just because you don't know the age of someone online does not mean you get to assume they are over 18. Regardless of whether or not he knew her age, it's still a crime.
Absolutely. It sounds to me like the crime was done, and he will be punished for it. I'm more just exploring the morality or intent of his actions. Hoping they aren't as malicious as they sound.
Jobon [#34]I was marginally smarter as a 21 year old male. DK screwed up big time, and he'll have to face the punishment that comes with it. But none of these kids are prepared for how life changing this experience has been for them, and it seems to me that the OWL is doing a poor job of helping them through real-life. Most sport stars were pseudo celebs their whole lives, and figured out how to manage the expectations and popularity since they were young teens. Most of these kids in OWL are just figuring this out for the first time in their lives right now.
YOU WERE MARGINALLY SMARTER AT 21?? Are you joking? This dude is a 21 year old MAN. A full grown adult. People are graduating college by 21 and voting and entering into all sorts of very advanced positions. He's probably had adult grown up sex. He's probably dated people for lengthy periods of time.
At 14 I had barely had my first real kiss and holding hands with girls was considered PDA. I thought myspace surveys were fun at 14. Also, by 21, I was pretty revolted by girls beyond 18 and even 20ish because of the maturity difference. If you can't recognize the difference between the maturity of a 21 and even an 18 year old, you're insane and that is worrisome.
The girl is too immature to understand the gravity of what is happening. She has absolutely zero clue. She doesn't know what it's like to go to bars or parties and be actually hit on. She has no idea what real flirting looks like or what healthy sexual boundaries are. People her age explore those things together as they grow up. They don't instantly start learning them from some adult creep. That's fucked up. ya, high schoolers and shit are sexual but they are sexual with each other. They both have similar sexual immaturity.
DK is solely at fault for this. As an adult, it is his responsibility to make healthy choices regarding actual children. That's why children have guardians and why they have acting guardians like teachers and coaches so someone is around to take responsibility for their well being because they aren't mature enough to be fully capable of understanding their own well being.
ethanVN02 [#4]And just as Boston has started to get really good. Man I used to really like dream, but he really should get released and fined.
A fine/release is the least of his worries. His career is pretty much done
wentaway [#25]Is not even Blizzard that should punish him, Blizard is a private company, is not their business punishing law infringements, it's the actual law that should take care of it.
It's normal for leagues to suspend their players if they're being investigated for this type of allegation. This is nothing new.
Guinea [#30]Yeah someone mentioned the legal part of it to me on Twitter and I admitted that I overlooked that, but at the same time regardless of whether its a sexual situation or not any 14 year old should know right from wrong, and based on everything else shes been saying it's pretty obvious she knows right from wrong. She even continued talking to him after they both said it was weird meaning Boy is actively participating in something they know is wrong and Girl is actively participating in something wrong. I personally think the particular situation should be looked at deeper than "Well shes a minor he's not, poor her" And like i said before, he is clearly MORE responsible but people are acting as if she was forced into something.
Some might be, but realistically it doesn't matter if she participated willingly. The moment he knew she was 14-15 was the moment he should have opted out because he knew what the consequences of his actions were.
Again, the problem isn't that she wasn't a willing participant, clearly she was, it's that he kept being involved with her in that way despite being aware of her age.
This is assuming that she didn't lie about revealing her age to him.
wentaway [#37]Her parents should thou, and generally speaking all parents should pay attention to their kids, even if "just" to avoid them ending up in situations like this.
I remember starting smoking when I was 14, and that older friend of mine who made me try, I know this is a whole different magnitude of a situation, but I don't blame him for making me start smoking, my parents did blame him, I stil don't now, almost 30 years later and still a smoker, it was on me I was already old enough to understand I was doing something wrong and why?
Well the answer is simple, my parents.
Irrelevant to this issue at hand.
Assuming she actually did tell him how old she was, he is the sole person responsible for his situation. She has nothing to do with it according to the law, and he should have known the risks involved with pursuing her at that point.
Generation1 [#42]Some of these responses here and on reddit are big YIKES. Some of y'all are terrifying. Stay away from children please.
I guess some of the responses might be cultural differences, but people fail to understand that the moment DK knew her age, again assuming that she actually did tell him, he was solely in the wrong and she can't be blames for anything that happened afterwards.
Hell even if she fully consented and this got found out in some other way he'd still be in the wrong because of her age.
Really simple concept even if the situation is more complicated.
KuroiRyuu9625 [#47]I guess some of the responses might be cultural differences, but people fail to understand that the moment DK knew her age, again assuming that she actually did tell him, he was solely in the wrong and she can't be blames for anything that happened afterwards.
Hell even if she fully consented and this got found out in some other way he'd still be in the wrong because of her age.
Really simple concept even if the situation is more complicated.
I don't think people are failing to understand that. You're right, the law is pretty simple. But exactly as you're saying "assuming he did know her age". And I think we know enough of the story to guess that he did, but its possible he didn't, or was misled.
SKYTRiXSHA [#2]rip, the girl is tho totally clueless LMAO
Do you get off on being the fuckin worst?
KuroiRyuu9625 [#46]Irrelevant to this issue at hand.
Assuming she actually did tell him how old she was, he is the sole person responsible for his situation. She has nothing to do with it according to the law, and he should have known the risks involved with pursuing her at that point.
I think people are just falling back on the legal part too much. From the get go I was talking about her innocence in the situation because people are acting like she was a rape victim. Thats all. Hell If I was a rape victim I would literally be offended, but thats just me. Regardless of what the law says, or what anyone else says, she is not innocent. That doesnt mean I think Dream is a victim (ive been accused of that already) and I also dont think it cushions his fall at all, I feel about his actions the same way everyone else does and thats what people are failing to understand I just think people should stop ignoring her role in it.
Guinea [#51]I think people are just falling back on the legal part too much. From the get go I was talking about her innocence in the situation because people are acting like she was a rape victim. Thats all. Hell If I was a rape victim I would literally be offended, but thats just me. Regardless of what the law says, or what anyone else says, she is not innocent. That doesnt mean I think Dream is a victim (ive been accused of that already) and I also dont think it cushions his fall at all, I feel about his actions the same way everyone else does and thats what people are failing to understand I just think people should stop ignoring her role in it.
She had no role. Dream, at every point throughout the process, could have ended it. Stop blaming a 14 year-old girl for the actions of a predator.
Raisin [#52]She had no role. Dream, at every point throughout the process, could have ended it. Stop blaming a 14 year-old girl for the actions of a predator.
And you're a prime example of what im talking about. At no point did I think shes responsible for his actions. Read what I said before, 2 people doing something stupid, one person getting the heat. Thats it.
blitz0623 [#43]A fine/release is the least of his worries. His career is pretty much done
Players have been permabanned from far less strict leagues for WAY less serious offenses. He will never play again. See also: iBP in CounterStrike.
Guinea [#54]And you're a prime example of what im talking about. At no point did I think shes responsible for his actions. Read what I said before, 2 people doing something stupid, one person getting the heat. Thats it.
That's the damn point. They aren't two people doing something stupid. It's one 14-year old acting like a 14 year old, and one 21 year old acting like a predator.
Raisin [#56]That's the damn point. They aren't two people doing something stupid. It's one 14-year old acting like a 14 year old, and one 21 year old acting like a predator.
If you really think thats average or even worse normal and acceptable behavior for a 14 year old then I hope you don't end up with kids.
Guinea [#57]If you really think thats average or even worse normal and acceptable behavior for a 14 year old then I hope you don't end up with kids.
If you think that she deserves to be blamed at all for what happened, I hope you don't end up with them either. Like I've said before, I was a moron at 14, everyone I know was a moron at 14. You were probably a moron at 14. Kids make mistakes. Young people are easily taken advantage of, especially by people they look up to. It's not their fault.
Dream did 100% wrong, but the girl had the idea to ruin his career and also wanted to benefit from it 100%.
Atleast what ive seen from the girls logs https://twitter.com/Carter_OW/status/983136511863406592
paolodicandio [#60]gotta ask for that passport nowadays this minors put so much makeup and have already tits and big ass u dont even recognize their age anymore. psycho this young girls
Yeah, my friend had a case when 15yo girl contacted him in tinder while saying she is 18.
(She actually looked around 18-19 easily)
Well he smashed and 2weeks after girl went to police and said that she has been raped and stuff, thank god my friend had to tinder messeges and such saved..
Never know when you get catfished
https://postimg.org/image/hqb8i8re7/
He's so fucked only 12 year olds react to a message this cheesy like that :o
but if we take this message, dream seems 12 aswell no sane 21 year old man will write things like this
mayb this american fuck boys need sbb as role model in their life
SKYTRiXSHA [#59]Dream did 100% wrong, but the girl had the idea to ruin his career and also wanted to benefit from it 100%.
Atleast what ive seen from the girls logs https://twitter.com/Carter_OW/status/983136511863406592
Rolf if this is true, in this case we should be allowed to hit the female gender again with our leather belts.
Bolton [#55]Players have been permabanned from far less strict leagues for WAY less serious offenses. He will never play again. See also: iBP in CounterStrike.
matchfixing way worse than kidfixing
Raisin [#58]If you think that she deserves to be blamed at all for what happened, I hope you don't end up with them either. Like I've said before, I was a moron at 14, everyone I know was a moron at 14. You were probably a moron at 14. Kids make mistakes. Young people are easily taken advantage of, especially by people they look up to. It's not their fault.
It IS their fault if they make poor choices. It's about responsibility. Have fun wiping your kids ass when they're 14 because it seems like that's the amont of capability you think they have
twerp [#29]i think you're missing the concept as to why 18 is the age of consent in US. any younger you're expected to be dumb and not competent enough to make that decision yourself. so you're depending on anyone 18+ to be responsible enough to not interact with anyone younger in that manner under any circumstances.
she's 14 and he did interact with her in that way. yeah maybe she had ill intentions going into it or it developed into ill intentions (after seeing the "get what he deserves hehe " tweet), but that doesn't matter at all. it all falls onto his shoulders. he's an adult and she's a kid being a kid
outside of this conversation and dreamkazpers situation
americans pls learn about your law, age of consent in most states is 16 years and in many european countries its 14
18 has nothing to do with sex (other than watching porn which is pretty dumb when you can legaly have sex but not watch it on the internet but thats totally offtopic)
SKYTRiXSHA [#59]Dream did 100% wrong, but the girl had the idea to ruin his career and also wanted to benefit from it 100%.
Atleast what ive seen from the girls logs https://twitter.com/Carter_OW/status/983136511863406592
she has no way of benefitting from this, she’s now targeted and getting hate from all sorts of people.
So she created an entire new persona, for what? he just randomly plucked her out on the OWL stream ahead of the other 140k people, did she have the golden ticket? why did she create a new name, was it LillylovesDKplsdmME? we act like a 14 year old is braindead and not allowed to make any decisions for herself yet in some states in USA (FL I believe) you can even work at 14, there are underage child marriages happening in the states and in 2 years she can buy herself a nice powerful car to drive around the streets, get herself a job and even apply for the army I believe? maybe even buy a gun, yet 2 years before ALL of that she's so fucking brainless she just has to do what someone asks her to?
This entire thing smells like a honey trap to me, look at the maturity in that statement "she" posted yet on her texts she comes across as someone with downsyndrome? plus the fact everything about her is a mystery and do people even know what she looks like, where she lives and all that shit? did she actually send nudes of herself and have they been confirmed as real?
Honestly, this entire thing smells like bullshit, sadly this is 2018 and thanks to social media we all have an opinion and like to play judge jury and executioner, but before we hang this guy from a tree upside down with his heart hanging out like most people want to do, let's wait for some fucking facts on the matter.
I can guarantee you one thing, this shit happens all the time and I could do the same, pretend to be a young female to trick someone to either ruin their lives or extort them, it does happen so don't automatically assume this "lilly" person is legit when there's not a single shred of evidence to suggest it is indeed a 14 year old girl.
Do you all remember a famous hacker who pretended for years he was a female until he got arrested and was a guy just pretending? it happens, don't be so naive. Bring on the downvotes, make me horny.
so does anyone have an actual proof of sexual interactions?
first I saw this https://postimg.org/image/ax6qris3z/ and I was like wtf dude u fuked up, but then I actually also saw the full conversation and the context was meant on his own hands because he said he has soft hands. she probably only pictured it like this and not the full conversation for a reason.
I can tell you what the case here is an overly attached psycho bitch that refused to reveal her real age at first because she's obsessed with getting the attention from an owl player and as soon he stopped the contact she went bat shit cray.
For me as a german this whole drama is just bizarre, considering the age of consent here in germany is 14, which applies to a lot of other countrys as well.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_consent#/media/File:Age_of_Consent_-_Global.svg
Apparently in California its 18. When I look at the postet map, no or almost no other western country has a age of consent this high.
Ok, it was illegal in the USA. Still, i think treating him like a criminal is a joke.
poi98 [#66]I think pasch's tweet is all.
https://twitter.com/paschlol/status/983182790752591872?s=19
Well said indeed
robokun87 [#72]So she created an entire new persona, for what? he just randomly plucked her out on the OWL stream ahead of the other 140k people, did she have the golden ticket? why did she create a new name, was it LillylovesDKplsdmME? we act like a 14 year old is braindead and not allowed to make any decisions for herself yet in some states in USA (FL I believe) you can even work at 14, there are underage child marriages happening in the states and in 2 years she can buy herself a nice powerful car to drive around the streets, get herself a job and even apply for the army I believe? maybe even buy a gun, yet 2 years before ALL of that she's so fucking brainless she just has to do what someone asks her to?
This entire thing smells like a honey trap to me, look at the maturity in that statement "she" posted yet on her texts she comes across as someone with downsyndrome? plus the fact everything about her is a mystery and do people even know what she looks like, where she lives and all that shit? did she actually send nudes of herself and have they been confirmed as real?
Honestly, this entire thing smells like bullshit, sadly this is 2018 and thanks to social media we all have an opinion and like to play judge jury and executioner, but before we hang this guy from a tree upside down with his heart hanging out like most people want to do, let's wait for some fucking facts on the matter.
I can guarantee you one thing, this shit happens all the time and I could do the same, pretend to be a young female to trick someone to either ruin their lives or extort them, it does happen so don't automatically assume this "lilly" person is legit when there's not a single shred of evidence to suggest it is indeed a 14 year old girl.
Do you all remember a famous hacker who pretended for years he was a female until he got arrested and was a guy just pretending? it happens, don't be so naive. Bring on the downvotes, make me horny.
I agree with you, I don't like how his career was ended before any official statement asserted it.
There's a screenshot where he says he knew she was in high school, if this one gets verified he's done for though
Even if everything were to be fabricated (I know there's like 0% chance in this situation but still) his reputation is ruined and Boston couldn't keep him anymore. The social media took the decision concerning his career over the team and this is sad. This is what Black Mirror is all about
MaSc [#74]For me as a german this whole drama is just bizarre, considering the age of consent here in germany is 14, which applies to a lot of other countrys as well.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_consent#/media/File:Age_of_Consent_-_Global.svg
Apparently in California its 18. When I look at the postet map, no or almost no other western country has a age of consent this high.Ok, it was illegal in the USA. Still, i think treating him like a criminal is a joke.
Said something similar on reddit and got downvoted to oblivion. At least it started a nice discussion. I mean, of course the laws of the country apply but it's interesting, how much cultural differences influence the reception of this alleged incident.
Career over: Yes
Dumb as bricks: Yes, he has a gf and writes like this with a 14-year-old. Also, who the fuck writes in this way anyways.
Exploitation: Might argue, she seemed to know what she was doing but he is supposed to be an adult.
Pedophilia: Hell No. Putting him in the same category as legit human garbage is just weird. And like the guy in the other thread said, it's unfair to the actual child victims of pedophiliacs.
gzuzz [#64]Rolf if this is true, in this case we should be allowed to hit the female gender again with our leather belts.
yikes
Yndi [#78]Said something similar on reddit and got downvoted to oblivion. At least it started a nice discussion. I mean, of course the laws of the country apply but it's interesting, how much cultural differences influence the reception of this alleged incident.
Career over: Yes
Dumb as bricks: Yes, he has a gf and writes like this with a 14-year-old. Also, who the fuck writes in this way anyways.
Exploitation: Might argue, she seemed to know what she was doing but he is supposed to be an adult.
Pedophilia: Hell No. Putting him in the same category as legit human garbage is just weird. And like the guy in the other thread said, it's unfair to the actual child victims of pedophiliacs.
If we're going off of assumptions and trusting her word (which we have to for now), Dream sending her sexually explicit images/texts IS actually pedophilia. Maybe it's a cultural difference because I'm seeing a lot of differing opinions on the severity of the matter between EU folks and US people.
What will change the actual severity of his punishment if this DOES become a legal issue outside of OWL will be if Dream ever solicited sexually explicit images from her (and from what we can tell, it looks like he did). That's child pornography, and should definitely fall under the same umbrella as pedophilia since that's really disgusting and a clear abuse of his power.
SKYTRiXSHA [#59]Dream did 100% wrong, but the girl had the idea to ruin his career and also wanted to benefit from it 100%.
Atleast what ive seen from the girls logs https://twitter.com/Carter_OW/status/983136511863406592
Not gonna defend DK, but she doesn't seem to be clean as well.
"After talking with close friends on the subject over the course of a month." - This part seems a bit of stinky tbh. 1 month of talk with friends OR plan how to ruin his career? Also she didn't mention anything about going to police if it was a pedophilia (DK is a public person, so it wouldn't be a problem to find him).
poinTOW [#77]Its never a good sign when you start to discuss more about drama than actual league games..
this how the mainstream media make money
ppl rather hear the negative than the positive cuz it will trigger their emotions harder
CamRa [#83]https://heavy.com/games/2018/04/dreamkazper-has-a-second-alleged-victim-16-years-old-exclusive/
Y I K E S
i remember that #metoo thing 2 days later its was 2000 other people coming forward with it, lets see how many will get on this train now.
also in this one it doesnt seem like there was any sexual interaction just friendly guy trying to make friends jaw dropping pictures could also mean nice picture of hamburger or juicy lasagne for me.
poi98 [#66]I think pasch's tweet is all.
https://twitter.com/paschlol/status/983182790752591872?s=19
Ok this is the most important thing in this thread. Idk why y’all are continuously trying to disparage a 14 year old in this terrible situation, even if she knew she was ending Dream’s career who cares, I have a simple solution to avoid that... DONT SEXT A 14 YEAR OLD
gabeconte [#80]If we're going off of assumptions and trusting her word (which we have to for now), Dream sending her sexually explicit images/texts IS actually pedophilia. Maybe it's a cultural difference because I'm seeing a lot of differing opinions on the severity of the matter between EU folks and US people.
What will change the actual severity of his punishment if this DOES become a legal issue outside of OWL will be if Dream ever solicited sexually explicit images from her (and from what we can tell, it looks like he did). That's child pornography, and should definitely fall under the same umbrella as pedophilia since that's really disgusting and a clear abuse of his power.
Under the assumptions that the allegations levied against him are true here are some things he could get charged for:
These would fall under Pedophilia and would probably have him register as a Child Sex Offender along with it's legal ramifications.Note that I'm not an expert so I could be missing other charges that could be levied against him just as I could be wrong about California's specific state laws on this subject.
Take this with a grain of salt but...while this might seem ridiculous to some of you...that's wholly irrelevant. IF the investigation confirms what he's being accused of.
Babouh [#76]I agree with you, I don't like how his career was ended before any official statement asserted it.
There's a screenshot where he says he knew she was in high school, if this one gets verified he's done for though
Even if everything were to be fabricated (I know there's like 0% chance in this situation but still) his reputation is ruined and Boston couldn't keep him anymore. The social media took the decision concerning his career over the team and this is sad. This is what Black Mirror is all about
His immediate suspension is a normal course of action for leagues when players are under investigation for these types of things. He could be re-instated if they can prove that she lied about her age.
Note that police use this tactic (an actor portraying themselves as a younger individual) to catch individuals that solicit underage boys/girls. It doesn't matter who she actually is, if he knew and believed she was 14-15 he's liable to be charged.
The only way he (possibly) walks away from this is if the investigation can prove that he assumed that she was of age. I don't know what the League or Boston's course of action would be at that point though.
User's of this site and reddit, all of our opinions are irrelevant. There is only one place to turn to and that is the law.
If you sleep with an underage person in the US and you are a day older than the age of consent, it is statutory rape. End of. You don't have to agree with that, it is a fact. It is a law created to protect children. If you don't like the law, I suggest not breaking it. Exposing yourself to some one may be argued in the same realms.
There are screenshots of DK acknowledging her age. He needs a fork put in him pronto - he is done.
Forget OWL, forget eSports, forget ever having a life where you don't knock on your neighbours doors to introduce yourself as anything other than a (potentially) convicted sex offender - he's looking at an extended period in prison.
Let me be completely and utterly clear here, or rather, let the law speak:
Section 1470 of Title 18, United States Code, prohibits any individual from knowingly transferring or attempting to transfer obscene matter using the U.S. mail or any means or facility of interstate or foreign commerce to a minor under 16 years of age. Convicted offenders face fines and imprisonment for up to 10 years.
That is one single charge. The ADA or DA (I presume in CA?) will go after him for other counts too, it's never "just" one thing. The law is unambiguous and it doesn't anywhere say "ah well he's not a peado or a predator like come on he's a DPS".
This is an argument for lawyers to thrash out of course, but this is about as bad as it gets for a 21 year old. He is in a world of trouble.
Laws exist to protect the masses, in this instance, children. A 15 year old is deemed a child in the United States, all other jurisdictions are utterly irrelevant. You don't have to accept or reject that DK is some how predatory or not, however he is absolutely fucked now.
Guinea [#68]It IS their fault if they make poor choices. It's about responsibility. Have fun wiping your kids ass when they're 14 because it seems like that's the amont of capability you think they have
You also fail to realize that a 14 y/o might not always think about the long term consequences, hence why the age of consent applies. I think it's different because the number is so high in Cali (it's 16 across the board for Canada) but below that the law judges you to not have the appropriate knowledge to make an informed and educated decision about sexual activity compared to your partner if they're at an age that is arbitrarily older than you. People develop at different paces and you can't expect all 14 y/o to have the maturity level to fully comprehend the weight of their actions.
You need look no further than some of her responses that people have been circulating to see that she's not the most mature teenager out there.
Dream on the other hand is old enough to have a solid grasp of the consequences of his actions but failed to keep the relationship to acceptable levels in the eyes of the law.
We have to fall back on the law because that's the rule set we have to follow. If your laws are different then it's understandable that you don't understand, but that's entirely irrelevant to this case and it's implications, including her involvement and/or intent in the situation with the exception being that she'd have to be charged with blackmail/extortion. Though at that point I don't know what the legal gymnastics would look like.
MaSc [#74]For me as a german this whole drama is just bizarre, considering the age of consent here in germany is 14, which applies to a lot of other countrys as well.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_consent#/media/File:Age_of_Consent_-_Global.svg
Apparently in California its 18. When I look at the postet map, no or almost no other western country has a age of consent this high.Ok, it was illegal in the USA. Still, i think treating him like a criminal is a joke.
He's currently at best, a potential suspect in the grooming of a minor. So yeah, calling the grooming of a child who won't be allowed to drive for another 2 years, or indeed vote for another 4 years a joke, is revolting. Quite telling about your view on this too.
I mean, do you find yourself attracted to 14 year olds just because it is law? The law is to protect 14 year olds and 15 year olds from not living a life behind bars being demolished by fellow prisoners, not to green light child exploitation.
By the way, if a 25 year old guy turns up in Thüringen or Baumschulenweg to date some dude's 14 year old daughter, you know how that ends right ... The law in Germany (I live here) is a joke, a 14 year old is barely into.through puberty with a still under developed brain and has few of the faculties required to make adult decisions. But I guess, respect the law? Anyone who's 18+ and believes a 14 year old is fair game needs their head examined.
KuroiRyuu9625 [#46]Irrelevant to this issue at hand.
Assuming she actually did tell him how old she was, he is the sole person responsible for his situation. She has nothing to do with it according to the law, and he should have known the risks involved with pursuing her at that point.
Are you this girl's lawyer?'cause you know, from your point of view also speaking of the laws should be irrelevant, but ehi... we can simply avoid speaking at all.
In the correct order:
KuroiRyuu9625 [#44]It's normal for leagues to suspend their players if they're being investigated for this type of allegation. This is nothing new.
Irrelevant, as if it was just Blizzard punishing his behaviour something would be very wrong.
MaSc [#74]For me as a german this whole drama is just bizarre, considering the age of consent here in germany is 14, which applies to a lot of other countrys as well.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_consent#/media/File:Age_of_Consent_-_Global.svg
Apparently in California its 18. When I look at the postet map, no or almost no other western country has a age of consent this high.Ok, it was illegal in the USA. Still, i think treating him like a criminal is a joke.
"it was illegal"
"treating him like a criminal is a joke."
:thinking:
jail time is in the realm of possibilities. also 14 is a child, not much different than if she were any younger
robokun87 [#72]So she created an entire new persona, for what? he just randomly plucked her out on the OWL stream ahead of the other 140k people, did she have the golden ticket? why did she create a new name, was it LillylovesDKplsdmME? we act like a 14 year old is braindead and not allowed to make any decisions for herself yet in some states in USA (FL I believe) you can even work at 14, there are underage child marriages happening in the states and in 2 years she can buy herself a nice powerful car to drive around the streets, get herself a job and even apply for the army I believe? maybe even buy a gun, yet 2 years before ALL of that she's so fucking brainless she just has to do what someone asks her to?
This entire thing smells like a honey trap to me, look at the maturity in that statement "she" posted yet on her texts she comes across as someone with downsyndrome? plus the fact everything about her is a mystery and do people even know what she looks like, where she lives and all that shit? did she actually send nudes of herself and have they been confirmed as real?
Honestly, this entire thing smells like bullshit, sadly this is 2018 and thanks to social media we all have an opinion and like to play judge jury and executioner, but before we hang this guy from a tree upside down with his heart hanging out like most people want to do, let's wait for some fucking facts on the matter.
I can guarantee you one thing, this shit happens all the time and I could do the same, pretend to be a young female to trick someone to either ruin their lives or extort them, it does happen so don't automatically assume this "lilly" person is legit when there's not a single shred of evidence to suggest it is indeed a 14 year old girl.
Do you all remember a famous hacker who pretended for years he was a female until he got arrested and was a guy just pretending? it happens, don't be so naive. Bring on the downvotes, make me horny.
i think you in particular should take the "Stay away from children please." comment above to heart. this entire post is actually a monkaMega
hamsolo [#90]He's currently at best, a potential suspect in the grooming of a minor. So yeah, calling the grooming of a child who won't be allowed to drive for another 2 years, or indeed vote for another 4 years a joke, is revolting. Quite telling about your view on this too.
I mean, do you find yourself attracted to 14 year olds just because it is law? The law is to protect 14 year olds and 15 year olds from not living a life behind bars being demolished by fellow prisoners, not to green light child exploitation.
By the way, if a 25 year old guy turns up in Thüringen or Baumschulenweg to date some dude's 14 year old daughter, you know how that ends right ... The law in Germany (I live here) is a joke, a 14 year old is barely into.through puberty with a still under developed brain and has few of the faculties required to make adult decisions. But I guess, respect the law? Anyone who's 18+ and believes a 14 year old is fair game needs their head examined.
Obviously 18 and 14 wouldn't be okay, but like 18,0 and like 16,7 or something might sound not too bad, but surely 21 and 14 is not okay. This might be different in many countries as I think in Finland that age is 15 or 16, but this Dreamkazper case is a still a bit odd one for me (since I don't know enough facts).
The facts I know are:
1) Dreamkazper has been texting (Facetime, Snapchat what ever) with a girl who claims to be 14
2) Saying "He send me dick picks in snapchat, but they are not there anymore since snapchat won't keep those photos longer than one day" won't make it true. It can still be true, but without proof it's kind of odd thing to say. Although since it seems Boston Uprising already terminated his contract there's some (or all of it) truth in this story.
3) "Friendship" between 21 and 14 years olds isn't illegal, but of course sexual photos between them would be illegal.
Things that I don't know:
1) What Dreamkazper have actually been sending to a girl or asking girl to send to him
2) When girl told her age to Dreamkazper (before or after sending or asking nudes etc.)
3) To be honest I still don't know, if the girl actually is 14 or whatever she claims to be. (I don't expect this to be told in publicly, but I would expect this to be check out privately by like checking ID's or something)
As overall it's pretty hard to follow up these kind of things, when you won't be provided all the information (mostly, because some of it is very personal and sensitive information). If he wouldn't have get sanctioned we could imagine girl would have been lying, but as it seems Boston terminated Dreamkazper's contract there's at least some truth in this story. It's just hard to see a full picture in this whole story as we will not be provided enough information.
hamsolo [#88]User's of this site and reddit, all of our opinions are irrelevant. There is only one place to turn to and that is the law.
If you sleep with an underage person in the US and you are a day older than the age of consent, it is statutory rape. End of. You don't have to agree with that, it is a fact. It is a law created to protect children. If you don't like the law, I suggest not breaking it. Exposing yourself to some one may be argued in the same realms.
There are screenshots of DK acknowledging her age. He needs a fork put in him pronto - he is done.
Forget OWL, forget eSports, forget ever having a life where you don't knock on your neighbours doors to introduce yourself as anything other than a (potentially) convicted sex offender - he's looking at an extended period in prison.
Let me be completely and utterly clear here, or rather, let the law speak:
Section 1470 of Title 18, United States Code, prohibits any individual from knowingly transferring or attempting to transfer obscene matter using the U.S. mail or any means or facility of interstate or foreign commerce to a minor under 16 years of age. Convicted offenders face fines and imprisonment for up to 10 years.
That is one single charge. The ADA or DA (I presume in CA?) will go after him for other counts too, it's never "just" one thing. The law is unambiguous and it doesn't anywhere say "ah well he's not a peado or a predator like come on he's a DPS".
This is an argument for lawyers to thrash out of course, but this is about as bad as it gets for a 21 year old. He is in a world of trouble.
Laws exist to protect the masses, in this instance, children. A 15 year old is deemed a child in the United States, all other jurisdictions are utterly irrelevant. You don't have to accept or reject that DK is some how predatory or not, however he is absolutely fucked now.
Thank you. Everyone is arguing about the little things such as if Lily was mature, if the whole thing was fabricated- this is a law, it was broken by DK, it’s as simple as that, he’ll suffer the consequences.
wentaway [#31]Nobody (at least here, for sure not me) is denying that twerp, this opens up a different argument thou, one that will expose me for the old geezer I am, why should a 14 year old girl/guy have free unmonitored access to internet and a cellphone?
Yes you can get in a lot of trouble even without those tools, it just requires dedication, while like this all it takes is the time to type a sentence.
The fact she was still actively posting on Twitter is wrong as well, luckily she (or someone else) made the account private.
If you're not actively using the internet and a cell phone by 14 in today's society, you're going to be left in the dust by ALL of your peers. It's just reality. The longer you keep your children from these things, the more harm you cause them. The solution is to help develop healthy relationships, decision making and boundaries with technology and the internet just like anything else.
wentaway [#91]Are you this girl's lawyer?'cause you know, from your point of view also speaking of the laws should be irrelevant, but ehi... we can simply avoid speaking at all.
In the correct order:
- There are laws.
- Someone broke the llaw, Dreamkazper in this specific case.
- He has to pay the consequences.
- She doesn't "deserve" this (who in his/her friggin right mind would think that!?)
- Should we think, since there are laws that now everything is fine?
- Considering how immature this girl is, do you honestly believe leave her free access to all those means of communication was a smart idea? Who should have checked it? The law? Dreamkazper? Or maybe, her parents?
...Dreamkazper because he's an adult and should know that he shouldn't take advantage of a 14 year old. The parents are her guardians and care about her, but it is not their job to monitor her every action to make sure some predator isn't taking advantage of her.
She's 14 as well. While 14 year olds are still stupid and do need guardians and guidance, they are old enough to begin forming their own opinions and making their own decisions. The parents who don't start allowing their children longer leashes upon entering high school are insane and blaming any parent for offering incremental amounts of independence is asinine.
dedC [#100]what characters does mistakes play other then tracer and sombra? what good replacements are there for dk, sucks cuz he was such a flexible and skilled player
He play a good genji and soldier...he is really good...also Striker can play projectile... I could see Mistakes tracer and Striker flex dps
Generation1 [#98]...Dreamkazper because he's an adult and should know that he shouldn't take advantage of a 14 year old. The parents are her guardians and care about her, but it is not their job to monitor her every action to make sure some predator isn't taking advantage of her.
She's 14 as well. While 14 year olds are still stupid and do need guardians and guidance, they are old enough to begin forming their own opinions and making their own decisions. The parents who don't start allowing their children longer leashes upon entering high school are insane and blaming any parent for offering incremental amounts of independence is asinine.
Generation1, this is the last post I'll ever make on this kind of "non game related" topic, so I'm sorry if I won't be answering a possible reply of yours, but eh I drew a line for myself and I'll stick to it.
You can't control others (dreamkapzer's predatorial behaviour in this case), what you can do, as a parent/older relative of a young boy/girl is provide every kind of information to your kids, so that it makes them less easy to be targets of such scumbags.
That means, I know you can't avoid giving this kind of tools to modern teenagers, and enforcing draconian rules on kids, usually never works if not even achieves the contrary effect.
But you can't simply "give up", leaving them to drag their own conclusions on what is right, what is wrong without having your voice in it, it should happen way earlier, but is never too late.
This of course applies to both, 'cause if dreamkapzer ended to be what he is it means somewhere down line something went wrong, something very big.
Laws then are (luckily) there to punish when this shit happens, but then it's already too late.
Tears [#19]i don't know if this is funny given the context my guy
didn't kazper send nudes to the girl though?
gabeconte [#80]If we're going off of assumptions and trusting her word (which we have to for now), Dream sending her sexually explicit images/texts IS actually pedophilia. Maybe it's a cultural difference because I'm seeing a lot of differing opinions on the severity of the matter between EU folks and US people.
What will change the actual severity of his punishment if this DOES become a legal issue outside of OWL will be if Dream ever solicited sexually explicit images from her (and from what we can tell, it looks like he did). That's child pornography, and should definitely fall under the same umbrella as pedophilia since that's really disgusting and a clear abuse of his power.
I'm curious because I didn't see anything sexual in the convo she posted except for the handy comment which was about his own soft hands, and even though I still agree that he's a scumbag for flirting with her even if he didn't know her age (he has a gf already) I feel like I missed something.
CamRa [#83]https://heavy.com/games/2018/04/dreamkazper-has-a-second-alleged-victim-16-years-old-exclusive/
Y I K E S
ooooh that IS a yikes
poi98 [#101]He play a good genji and soldier...he is really good...also Striker can play projectile... I could see Mistakes tracer and Striker flex dps
taking striker off of tracer is a crime against humanity ompho
trashplayer [#65]matchfixing way worse than kidfixing
a few thousand dollars doesnt account to sexually harassing a child, what are you talking about
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